Adverse possession

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013 This query is : Resolved
HOW CAN I SELL THE IMMOVABLE PROPERTY
POSSESSED BY VIRTUE OF THE LAWS OF ADVERSE POSSESSION. NOT BY LEGAL PROCEEDINGS BUT ALL THE REQUIRED FORMALITIES FAVOR UNDER THE LAWS, ARE RETAINED BY ME.

THANKING YOU

RAJAN YADAV
NEW DELHI

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R.K Nanda (Expert) 19 March 2013
state full facts.

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
the shop possessed by the tenant since 1950 to 1972. after the death of the tenant )my father()
the property till today is undr my possession and the landlord died long before and his legal heirs never approached me for the rent since l975 (at this time i was studing) till today. I have tried to approach him, but he never responded. no exchange of letters or legal notice to me since over 30 yrs.

ajay sethi (Expert) 19 March 2013
you are lucky . you are enjoying property without having paid for it . since you dont have any itle deds you cant sell the property . without clear title no one will purchase the said shop

ajay sethi (Expert) 19 March 2013
you are lucky . you are enjoying property without having paid for it . since you dont have any title deeds you cant sell the property . without clear title no one will purchase the said shop

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
CANT I GET IT REGISTERED IN MY NAME AS A

LEGAL OCCUPIER AND THEN PASS ON ITS REGISTRY TO MY LEGAL HEIRS...

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Khoob bahoot khoob! what an idea sir ji?

A tenant can not claim title by adverse possession over property rented to him.

Let pass any length of time.

Adv k . mahesh (Expert) 19 March 2013
on whose name the property tax and other bills are coming

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
thanks sir,

Please see that i am not the tenant as i hve never paid any rent nor recd. any demand for rent from the landlord.......

with regards

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
But your father was inducted as tenant and you are claiming under your father.

Adv k . mahesh (Expert) 19 March 2013
thus any bills on your father name or your owner name

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
buisness activities paper in my name. electricity bill in father/s co, name which
never existed.

nothing is in owners name. the owner is dead, his legal heir is untraceable. Owners other properties are in the same situation.

house tax can be obtained in my name.

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
reply to mr, Prabhakar singh,

I understand the meaning of tenant and the
land lord, but circumstantially what can be the fate of the property, now.

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Where is the property situated?

Are all tenants are in same building or in separate building?

Earlier you told heirs of land lord do not respond.

Now you have stated they are not traceable?

What is the truth?

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
Sir, Respectfully, i say the property is in NCR,

there are few more tenants but no owner has any possession and the owner till last information lived too far.

When our efforts were made, the heir at that time did not respond, and currently for last
five years, lives in disguise and not traceable.

Please ask any question sir,

regardfully

Anirudh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Better enjoy the property yourself so long as you can.

SINCE YOU DO NOT HAVE ANY OWNERSHIP TITLE, AND YOUR POSSESSION IS NOT ADVERSE TO ANYBODY SINCE YOU (YOUR FATHER) HAD BEEN INDUCTED AS A TENANT, YOU SHALL EVER REMAIN A TENANT (UNLESS YOU FIRST PURCHASE THE PROPERTY FROM THE TRUE OWNER.)

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
My question was very specific when i asked:
"Are all tenants in same building or in separate buildings?"

your answer is evasive.:"there are few more tenants but no owner has any possession "

you told me "I understand the meaning of tenant and the land lord,"

Then be kind to understand when any building is let to a tenant then owner would naturally be not in possession, because that is what he parts in favor
of tenant in lieu of rent.

Any way tell facts inquired very specifically.

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
Dear sir Mr. Singh

all the tenants in the same building.

Landlord has no possession in any manner.

Anymore specification please.

regards.

cottonwellth@gmail.com

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
That is the hurdle "all the tenants in the same building."

This why I asked this very specific question.

How can you claim adverse possession over part of a building?Over a specific portion?

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Do you know how your land lord who is dead got this property?

I mean he inherited it or bought it?

If you do not know make search in registrar's office.

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
Sir,

Cant I claim the possession of the portion I
occupy.

What will be the fate of the property in future.

thanks

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
The owner status quo of being a landlord

cannot be established. He died when I grew young .

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Q.Cant I claim the possession of the portion
occupy.???

A.unfortunately not.

Q.What will be the fate of the property in future. ?

A.enjoy the possession pedigree to pedegree.

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Can all other tenants may agree to treat you owner?

R Yadav (Querist) 19 March 2013
Dear sir,

I wish to become the owner of that portion which i possess since. (IF THERE IS ANY PROVISION AS PER LAW)

Not interested to become the landlord of the entire property. Probably, I think no one is interested to intervene in my procedure. They may rather wud like to act the way I do,

Regards

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
I am sorry! Such a situation as you wish can
not be framed to my mind.

See how others opine.

Raj Kumar Makkad (Expert) 19 March 2013
Even if your father had died a long ago and you were never demanded any rent by landlord/owner of the property even then your status is same of the tenant. The tenancy in the given matter is month to month which even can be got terminated by landlord/owner as and when he appears.

It shall be better if you sale the possession of the property without registering any formal sale-deed (becs you cannot get it executed or registered) so your desire shall become fulfilled if buyer is ready to do so.

prabhakar singh (Expert) 19 March 2013
Dear yadav!
No problem even if you sale it by a registered deed PROVIDED YOU HAVE A BUYER
WHO TREATS YOU OWNER.

HAVE YOU HEARD OF TARANTULA?
THERE ARE?

R Yadav (Querist) 20 March 2013
Dear Mr. Makkad, namaskar,

Thanks for your views.

My target is not to become the landlord, my worry is how to operate the situation in future. The landlord is not in picture, nor he is willing to appear to claim rent neither registering the documents in my favour.

The premises has market value and cannot be left open for public access. One or the other day it has to get a name for others to get it a new owner and so on.

This is an exceptional case and I too have left no efforts to take the right decision.
In years I have not come across any legal expert who can draw a consolidate map.

you can imagine that anyone who may be,this is a matter of thought.

Please consider if possible.

Regards

R Yadav (Querist) 20 March 2013
Thanks to Mr. Prabhakar sir.

Noted your views. In the event I find a buyer willing to take on registered deed from me, how do I be clear off from any infringement or any legal obligations.

Regards

Raj Kumar Makkad (Expert) 20 March 2013
Mr. Yadav! As already clarified to you that an owner cannot be replaced without any registered deed or the ways provided under Transfer of Property Act. You legally do not possess any of such document in hand. Even then you want to become its owner rather of landlord. You have also been advised to sale its possession on affidavit bringing the subsequent buyer in the same status as you have.

You may personally contact in this regard.

Anirudh (Expert) 20 March 2013
Dear Yadav,
You seem to be an highly confused man.
You want to sell the property. But unfortunately you cannot sell since you are not the owner of the property.

You wanted to claim Adverse possession. This was also said not possible, since you are a tenant through your father.

You wanted to know whether you can have the property registered in your name - it was told that you cannot do it as only the True owner can execute a registered document in your favour and not otherwise.

You say that the landlord is not in possession of the property. YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY WRONG. LAND LORD IS STILL IN OWNERSHIP OF THE PROPERTY. He has only given the possession rights to his tenants (you are one of the tenants through your father).

You ask whether can I claim possession of the portion that I occupy. You need not claim any possession. You are already in possession of the portion AS A TENANT. (You cannot claim it as a OWNER).

You say "My target is not to become the landlord, my worry is how to operate the situation in future."

What future operation that you are talking about?

Ultimately you come back to the same original question: " In the event I find a buyer willing to take on registered deed from me, how do I be clear off from any infringement or any legal obligations."

IF YOU SELL THE PROPERTY, OF WHICH YOU ARE NOT THE OWNER, YOU WILL BE COMMITTING A FRAUD. YOU WILL BE CRIMINALLY LIABLE.

PULL STOP. We cannot go on reply to your greedy question.

R Yadav (Querist) 20 March 2013
Dear sir,

Thanks for your views.

Unfortunately, I have been listening to the similar replies from over a dozen of civil lawyers, other than on this forum.

But no body has been able to draw a legal path either due to their inability to solve such queries or they haven't come across such a case in their tenure.

My greediness does not lies anywhere, only the prime worry is what will happen one day when I need the help from the place or a person whom I have served for my life time.

Legal help is too provided to the national and international accused and to those heinous criminals.

Similarly I am too asking for legal opinion
under the situation I am facing it.

I am running for a legal opinion of a learned person so that no crime is committed by mistake or excuse. Be cool sir...thank you

Anirudh (Expert) 20 March 2013
Dear Yadav,

What do you mean by saying "only the prime worry is what will happen one day when I need the help from the place or a person whom I have served for my life time."
I don't understand. please explain.

The accuseds are also being given legal assistance (after they have got into trouble) to defend their case.

You are yet not in that category. You are trying to get legal advice prior to doing any wrong things. IF THERE ARE NO LEGAL PROVISIONS WHICH FAVOUR YOUR WISH, IT DOES NOT MEAN THE EXPERTS HERE HAVE NOT COME ACROSS SUCH INSTANCES IN THEIR TENURE.

The experts here have amply replied to you saying that you cannot sell the property as you are not the owner; you cannot claim ownership as of now since you still continue to be a tenant (through your father); you cannot claim adverse possession as your possession is not adverse.

WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT.

R Yadav (Querist) 20 March 2013
This is not a satisfactory reply....

ajay sethi (Expert) 20 March 2013
if you are not satisfied with reply of experts from LCI may i suggest that you contact a local lawyer in NCR with your papers and take his written opinion

prabhakar singh (Expert) 20 March 2013
Mr.Sethi!

He would not be satisfied with any BAR of world.

Because he wants to live in a WIN-WIN situation.

Because he is looking for a legal way to do an illegal thing so that he can sail out escort free of his motive for which he has his own pleas."He worries about the future of the property,what would happen to it if dies as tenant,some one will take over,then why should not he who has served and honored it by his unpaid occupation,should not he get consideration for it,and should not be some thing even more than ownership is his desire"

He says it is a matter of "THOUGHT" but he could not find a "THOUGHT FULL"lawyer despite his best efforts.

R Yadav (Querist) 20 March 2013
your opinion shows ??? of knowledge and understanding of Indian Law...

This is my fundamental right to know.

For justice both accused as well as the victim pays to WIN WIN situation. and who gets benifit out of it , may I know sir?

prabhakar singh (Expert) 20 March 2013
I am unable to understand why are you getting hurt every time a true legal position is being told to you.

You are being provided here "WHAT LAW IS ON TOPIC" by us keeping you WIN-WIN not only just because here people are aware of your fundamental rights but also because we are aware of our social obligations towards people visiting this site.

Like any field of knowledge law field is also ocean in which "I" looks of a size "i".
i have NO TALL claims in this respect.If in your estimates i do not know it,that sounds good for my health.
Anyway THANK YOU!

R Yadav (Querist) 20 March 2013
Sir,

Any advatange via ( prescriptive-easement)

without effecting others interest.

prabhakar singh (Expert) 20 March 2013
READ THE LAW FOR YOUR SELF THEN:

THE INDIAN EASEMENTS ACT, 1882

section 4. “Easement” defined.-An easement is a right which the owner or occupier of certain land possesses, as such, for the beneficial enjoyment of that land, to do and continue to do something, or to prevent and continue to prevent something being done, in or upon, or in respect of, certain other land not his own.

Dominant and servient heritages and owners. The land for the beneficial enjoyment of which the right exists is called the dominant heritage, and the owner or occupier thereof the dominant owner; the land on which the liability is imposed is called the servient heritage, and the owner or occupier thereof the servient owner.

Section 12. Who may acquire easements.- An easement may be acquired by the owner of the immovable property for the beneficial enjoyment of which the right is created, or on his behalf, by any person in possession of the same.

One of two or more co-owners of immovable property may, as such, with or without the consent of the other or others, acquire an easement for the beneficial enjoyment of such property.

No lessee of immovable property can acquire, for the beneficial enjoyment of other immovable property of his own, an easement in or over the property comprised in his lease.

Section 15. Acquisition by prescription.- Where the access and use of light or air to and for any building have been peaceably enjoyed therewith, as an easement, without interruption, and for twenty years, and where support from one person's land, or things affixed thereto, has been peaceably received by another person's land subjected to artificial pressure, or by things affixed thereto, as an easement, without interruption, and for twenty years,

and where a right of way or any other easement has been peaceably and openly enjoyed by any person claiming title thereto, as an easement and as of right, without interruption, and for twenty years, The right to such access and use of light or air, support, or other easement, shall be absolute.

Each of the said periods of twenty years shall be taken to be a period ending within two years next before the institution of the suit wherein the claim to which such period relates is contexted.

Explanation I: Nothing is an enjoyment within the meaning of this section when it has been had in pursuance of an agreement with the owner or occupier of the property over which the right is claimed, and it is apparent from the agreement that such right has not been granted as an easement, or, if granted as an easement, that it has been granted for a limited period, or subject to a condition on the fulfillment of which it is to cease.

Explanation II: Nothing is an interruption within the meaning of this section unless where there is an actual cessation of the enjoyment by reason of an obstruction by the act of some person other than the claimant, and unless such obstruction is submitted to or acquiesced in for one year after the claimant has notice thereof, and of the person making or authorizing the same to be made.

Explanation III: Suspensions of enjoyment in pursuance of a contract between the dominant and servient owners is not an interruption within the meaning of this section.

Explanation IV: In the case of an easement to pollute water, the said period of twenty years begins when the pollution first prejudices perceptibly the servient heritage.

When the property over which a right is claimed under this section belongs to Government, this section shall be read as if, for the words "twenty years" the words "thirty years" were substituted.

Illustrations

(a) A suit is brought in 1883 for obstructing a right of way. The defendant admits the obstruction, but denies the right of way. The plaintiff proves that the right was peaceable and openly enjoyed by him, claiming title thereto, as an easement, and as of right, without interruption, from lst January, 1862 to lst January, 1882. The plaintiff is entitled to judgement.

(b) In a like suit the plaintiff shows that the right was peaceable and openly enjoyed by him for twenty years, the defendant proves that for a year of that time the plaintiff was entitled to possession of the servient heritage as lessee thereof and enjoyed the right as such lessee. The suit shall be dismissed, for the right of way has not been enjoyed "as an easement" for twenty years.

(c) In a like suit the plaintiff shows that the right was peaceably and openly enjoyed by him for twenty years. The defendant proves that the plaintiff on one occasion during the twenty years had admitted that the user was not of right and asked his leave to enjoy the right. The suit shall be dismissed, for the right of way has not been enjoyed "as of right" for twenty years.

READ IT CAREFULLY AND IF ANY THING IN YOUR VIEW IS HELPFUL,REVERT BACK.

Raj Kumar Makkad (Expert) 21 March 2013
It seems instead of getting legal advice, you want to get illegal advice and that also free of cost and if any one gives you legal advice then you raise question mark over his ability to reply which is nothing but an abuse of this free site.

Raj Kumar Makkad (Expert) 21 March 2013
The experts should desist from entertaining such querist whose aim is to challenge the lawyers and seek the path to legalize his illegal acts.

R Yadav (Querist) 21 March 2013
Dear sirs,

All the learned members of the forum are respectable experts to me.

I have good regards and respect for all.

Well, this is a debate and not an argument.
I keep no knowledge to challenge anyone, Why do you feel so. Every question has been asked with due respect.

Infact you would agree that mine"s is an exceptional case and probably there may not be any ready reckoner to my solution.

I am not alone with this situation, there are many others to my knowledge who have same difficulty and their landlords are not traceable since the independence.

I feel especially thankful to Mr. P. Singh who has been very helpful in providing his extensive experience and for an active role.

I keep option open to receive any feasible
advise to my query.

With due respect to all.

Raj Kumar Makkad (Expert) 21 March 2013
This is not an exceptional case. This is may be first for you but in our professional life, such type of cases do come daily. This is not such strange think as you feel.

R Yadav (Querist) 21 March 2013
Dear Sir. Mr. P. SINGH

I FEEL DEEPLY IMPRESSED WITH YOUR FOLLOWING
ILLUSTRATION :

>>>>You are being provided here "WHAT LAW IS ON TOPIC" by us keeping you WIN-WIN not only just because here people are aware of your fundamental rights but also because we are aware of our social obligations towards people visiting this site.

>>>>>>>Like any field of knowledge law field is also ocean in which "I" looks of a size "i".
i have NO TALL claims in this respect.If in your estimates i do not know it,that sounds good for my health.<<<<<<<<<
Anyway THANK YOU!

R Yadav (Querist) 21 March 2013
SIR,

PROCEEDINGS UNDER SEC.138

AGAINST BOUNCED CHEQUE THE LEGAL NOTICE TIME OF 15 DAYS HAS ELAPSED AND NO REPLY RECIVED
FROM THE PERSON WHO ISSUED THE CHEQUE.

WHAT IS FAVOURABLE FOR THE PAYEE AND WHAT SHOULD BE THE FUTURE COURSE OF ACTION FOR RECOVERY OF THE CHEQUE AMOUNT.

THANKS

ajay sethi (Expert) 21 March 2013
file complaint for cheque bouncing

R Yadav (Querist) 21 March 2013
COMPLAINT WITH WHOM SIR ?

prabhakar singh (Expert) 21 March 2013
WHEN PAYMENT IS NOT MADE WITHIN 15 DAYS AFTER THE SERVICE OF THE NOTICE BY THE DRAWER THEN THE PAYEE/OR HOLDER IN DUE COURSE WHO GAVE THE NOTICE(CALLED COMPLAINANT IN COURT) HAS TO FILE A CRIMINAL CASE IN THE COURT OF JUDICIAL MAGISTRATE OF JURISDICTION WITHIN 30 DAYS FROM THE EXPIRY OF NOTICE PERIOD OF 15 DAYS .

R Yadav (Querist) 21 March 2013
Thanks sir.

If the legal notice remain un-replied, does it favour the complainant anyway.

prabhakar singh (Expert) 21 March 2013
IT IS THE NON COMPLIANCE OF NOTICE THAT CONSTITUTE COMMISSION OF OFFENCE UNDER
S.138 N.I ACT AND GIVES RIGHT TO PAYEE TO LODGE COMPLAINT IN C/JM COURT.

IF DRAWER PAYS WITH IN 15 DAYS OF NOTICE THEN NO COMPLAINT COULD BE FILED AS NO OFFENCE IS COMMITTED.