partnership firm property
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 20 March 2009
This query is : Resolved
A Partnership Firm of Raipur city,got registered in Yr.1975 in Bhopal,as it is situated in M.P state.It is having all the five partners from a single family.Firm mortgaged its property in PNB Bank ,in which it was existing for RS 2 lacs in YR 1975.
In Yr 1978 our 3 members entered in the Firm as new partners and their 3 partners , out of 5,,retired,so in Yr 1978 ,we were having 60% share in the Firm,as per Partnership Deed,signed by all the parners
.
In YR 1979,the said Firm was fully taken by our family and 2 new partners from our family entered in the Firm.The remaining old partners retired from the said Firm and against them ,as i said 2 members of our family entered in the Firm.We are not having proof now,ki the remaining 2 partners retired in Yr 1979,as we are not having in present the documents which contains the retiring party signature,stating that they retired from the Firm, in yr 1979.
Our problem is know,is that since our all the senior partners,which joined in 1979,were staying at Madras,so they got registered the Firm in Chennai ,as having its Head office there,without doing anything in Bhopal Registration office.In bhopal Reg.office only initial Partnership deed was given of YR.1975,when we were not partners.So according to Bhopal's Registration still starting parties are the partner of our Firm.
Our new partnership deed which was Registerd by us in Chennai,is silent of the property of the Firm.
We took out the property of Firm,where it is existing ,which was mortaged by the old partners somewhere in yr 1981 and got realesed Title Deed from PNB Bank.(please note,we are not having evidense now that we got realesed the T.Deed papers,but we have evidense ki old partners kept it for mortgage)
We are in possession of the property since then.We are having Industrail License for yr 1980 onwards in our 1 partner name,on behalf of the said Firm, also have Electricity and muncipality proof also in our name from Yr 1979.We are also having tenants in the property since from more than last 15 yrs.
Our problem is that ki old partners taking advantage of their name still in bhopal Registration office,started claming in Yr 2006,ki our firm is some other firm with the same name,as it is registerd in Chennai and they tied up with some mafia for its sale of its property.
We filed Civil suit agaist the old parties,but our case is strucked ki how to confirm that our firm and the old firm is same .
According to our Advocate,we have to prove it in Civil Court,as Judge is asking the same.
Is there is no time limitation for old partners who are challenging after approx 27 yrs?
We submitted all the Documents showing that we are in possession of the property from last 27 yrs , and still we are in possession.
What can we do,please suggest us.
can we file now,in bhopal registration office that we have been already registered in Chennai,so we dont need the Bhopal's registration or can we submit our new Partnership deed with Bhopal Registration office and get Registration here also?Can we do registration in two places or in two states?,
Please gove your valuable opinion and oblidge.
Thanking you sirs.
yours faithfully,
Sanjay chandak.
9300061575
A V Vishal
(Expert) 20 March 2009
Dear Mr Chandak,
Going by the contents of your query,prima facie you have committed blunder. As for the deed of partnership of 1978, your three members joined the firm Q1 was the reconstituted firm informed to the Registrar about new members admission and retirement of a part of old members in the firm. Subsequently the admission and retirement of the present partners and the balance old partners is also not evidenced by any document, Further you have not informed the registrar of the office opened at chennai, In absence of documentary evidence it is difficult to prove that both the firms are one and the same. As for the mortgaged propert, have you intimated the bank about the reconstitution of the firm, and admission of 2 more partners in '79. Further as per your version there is no proof that you repaid the mortgage loan. Do you physically hold the property docs. As for time limitation for claim of property, the claim has arisen out of the civil suit filed by you. Merely since the property tax and electricity bills are in your name is not sufficient to prove your ownership.
A V Vishal
(Expert) 20 March 2009
I would suggest you arrive at some kind of amicable settlement out of court and end the issue
A. A. JOSE
(Expert) 20 March 2009
I fully endorse above views. Amicable resolution is advisable course.
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 20 March 2009
Sir,
we are in possession of Original Title deed of the property in which the firm is existing,which we got from the PNB Bank after paying all the dues.
We have the proof that the property was kept for mortaged by the old partners,and we have the evidense of the bank of that time,but when we paid the dues,we were not knowing ki we will have to proof it,after several years i.e. after 26-27 yrs.
we are also in posession of the property and we are having tenants there,who were not paying rent to us,so we filed case in the court and all of them lost the case in civil court and all of them moved to Highcourt for stay.
previously the industrial license was in name of old partners till 1978,and after our entering the license is in name of our partner(new joined partner from our family) ,against the Firm.
we were not knowing ki firm is registered in Bhopal and also never thought ki,they will claim after 27 yrs and also according to Yr 1978 partnership deed,our family have 60% share in the Firm.
Please guide me.
we are having old partnership deeds from 1975 in our possession.
moreover Yr 1978 partnership deed,our first deed have term ki our one partner have right to make other parties retire ,and it will be binding on all the members-partners, and the deed as i told sighned by their managing partner.
kindly help us and suggest the action and oblidge
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 20 March 2009
We are also having in the possession many other orginal documents ,one important document is we are having original permission document from Munccipality for allowing to do construction,which was taken by the old partners for construction of bulding in 8000 sq ft of office and industry building in yr 1975.
A V Vishal
(Expert) 21 March 2009
Dear Chandak:
Suggest you hire a very good lawyer to fight the case, according to your version as told here, the so called documents are of no evidentiary value. What needs to be proved is that the old partners from the original partnership firm retired and the new partners were admitted. Further, you need to also prove that the Bhopal firm and the Chennai firm are one and the same. Incase you are able to prove them then there are chaances of the verdict in your favour
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 22 March 2009
it is not enough ki we are in poseession the property from yr 1979 due to out partnership deed,,,we are in possession of all the original partnership deeds before we entered,,,we are having original title deed of the property,,,,,all the tenants lost the case in lower court n all gone to High court for stay....is that is not enough,,,just a mistake ki we have not continued the registration in bhopal n did in chennai.....but we are not aware of the fact ki it is a registerd firm at the time of entering
A V Vishal
(Expert) 22 March 2009
Dear Chandak: Even a small mistake can cost a life. Ignorance of law is not an valid excuse. Furthermore, what law requires is evidence, you may feel to be correct on your part, but the other party also needs to be heard, in such circumstances what holds good is only the evidence, all I am saying u is to be proved is that the old partners from the original partnership firm retired and the new partners were admitted also prove that the Bhopal firm and the Chennai firm are one and the same.There ends the matter
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 24 March 2009
plz help me
A V Vishal
(Expert) 24 March 2009
Dear Chandak:
As per the partnership deed of 1978 I suggest you go for an arbitration, you can get some relief out of the arbitration proceedings. Even if the deed is unregistered you can go ahead.
Hiralal Das
(Expert) 04 April 2009
Yes,I agree with my learned friends. Please try to follow their valuable opinions.
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 05 April 2009
sir,
i recently got a reply from the opposite party on, against whom, we filed the title deed suit.We filed the title deed suit against the seller of the property ,who sold the property to the Firm in Yr.1975 and the Firm kept mortgaged the property in PNB bank.
They are writing in reply that they sold the property to the Firm,which was unregistered and the partners now,who are claming(WE) are different from the partners of the firm to whom they sold.They are also saying that our firm is Registered in chennai and is some different firm with the same name.
here the old partners are nowhere in the case,actually the seller of the property to the Firm were the real brothers of the old partners of the Firm,so we are telling ki old partners are saying ki our firm is different from their firm.
Do they have right to say that we are not legal owner of the Firm property.
Under Sec 39 rule 1 2 for status quo ,they are telling ki they have sold the property in Yr 1975 to then Existing Firm,and they are not going to sell the property to anyone else now.
What we can do in the case now?..our advocate is saying ki ,it can be tough for us in civil case in title deed suit ki our firm is same,,,,we have all the firm partnership deeds in original since from yr 1975 and original Title deed of the Firm property and also posession of the firms property.
Y V Vishweshwar Rao
(Expert) 05 April 2009
The observations /discussions made by our learned frined Sri Vishal is valuable .
The Old partners of 1975 and 1978 are disputign your new partnership
They admit that the proerty was sold in the year 1975 to the then Firm in which your family membrs were also partners to an extent of 60% share, the problem startend when the 3 three partners retired and your family members -three entered in to partnership with out any Docuement . The 60 % share as it was there till 1978/1979- whther the same is admitted by other side /opposite party -- ??
The partnership Act provisons are not complied in your old firm from time to time and the same created this kind of problems at a later statge
I hope that the old firm 60% share may work out for you
Querist :
Anonymous
(Querist) 05 April 2009
Sir,
As I told you in my last mail,old parners are not challenged yet in any court,,we were challenged by the seller of the property of the firm,who sold the property to the firm in Yr 1975.
We only filed case on them for getting status quo and Title deed Suit.
Please also note the said seller are real brothers of the old partners.
Sir,is there is any limitation of time to challenge by the old partners.
Can seller can say that -we or our firm is different from the firm to which they sold the property?
We are having all the partnership deeds from year 1975 ,original title deed of the property,all the property taxes and possession till date.
Y V Vishweshwar Rao
(Expert) 21 April 2009
Mr Sanjay for evey legal action there is time limit prescribed .
In the cases of Immovebale proerties the time is 12 years !
it appears the same is complted
You filed the suit for Status Quo- title suit .
The Proery accordign to you is in your exclussive possession since more than 20 years
Teh same will be cosnidered by the Court in Your suit, which is pendign disposal
with regards!
