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windowsxp   24 January 2017

Importance of arguments

Hi,

what importance do arguments (oral/written) carry during judgement, respondent avoiding to file arguments, judge gave date for judgement but unfortunately judge got transferred, new incharge judge joined but respondent dint showed interest to file arguments, so judge gave date for judgement.

how judge consider arguments while delivering the judgement? is it favours the petitioner?

Regards,

Srinivas

 

 



Learning

 19 Replies

Sachin (N.A)     24 January 2017

Yes, it will favour petitioner.

1 Like

windowsxp   24 January 2017

thanks for the reply Sachin.

 

 

Dr. Atul [9013898936] (Lawyer, Scholar)     25 January 2017

Arguments are important because many Judges avoid reading the entire case file (and, honestly, I can't blame them, given the volume of work and the fact that some of the pleadings being unreadable really). Even assuming a Judge has read the file, argruments still help in drawing the attention of the Court to the chief contentions of the party and precedents in support thereof (the classical rule of drafting insists that precedents should never be made a part of pleadings). Arguments may even otherwise help in building a perception in the mind of judicial officer in your favor and against the other party by presentation which cannot always be made a part of pleadings.

Written Arguments are also important becuase they bring on record the points for consideration raised by a party, which may assist in Appeals in showing that an important factor was brought to the notice of the Court but was not considered.

In your case if the Repondent is avoiding argument, all the better for you. Insist before the Court that since the Respondent is not willing to lead oral arguments, let the Court reserve final orders and permit the parties to file written arguments till a resonable time in the meanwhile, if they so choose (it is quite common). 

sai narayana   25 January 2017

'No arguments' itself doen't cause disfavour, but by filing arguments you can give a direction/dimension to draw the inference(s)/conclusion to case.

My guess is the respondent will take a date on the date of judgment to file arguments. I think he is employing delay tactics.

Sachin (N.A)     25 January 2017

Very well explained by Adv Atul.

Written arguments are very important because some judges don't read entire case file they ask their staff to highlight / mention important points of case , staff do it and judge only read those important points and came to the conclusion

whatnot   25 January 2017

@ Atul,

Could you please elobarate on  this point?. Thank you.

 

.........

(the classical rule of drafting insists that precedents should never be made a part of pleadings)

Read more at: https://www.lawyersclubindia.com/forum/Importance-of-arguments-146346.asp
 
 
....

Dr. Atul [9013898936] (Lawyer, Scholar)     25 January 2017

Originally posted by : whatnot
@ Atul,
Could you please elobarate on  this point?. Thank you.
.........
(the classical rule of drafting insists that precedents should never be made a part of pleadings)
....

What I meant was in Plaints/Petitions/Replies/Written Statements, properly speaking, one is not supposed to refer to judicial precedents. As in, it is not the correct way to draft pleadings if one is to write like in ABC vs. XYZ Court held such-and-such. 

I may clarify that there is no law, rule or regulation of pleading which specifies this or prevents reference to precedents in pleadings ... it is just a matter of convention, usage and practise developed over the years.

Many lawyers do ignore this and refer to precedents in pleadings, though it is something usually to be avoided (I've seen a senior lawyer being ripped apart by a High Court judge for having done that!), more so when one can do that by way of written arguments anyway.

1 Like

sai narayana   25 January 2017

Originally posted by : Atul (public ID)
Arguments are important because many Judges avoid reading the entire case file (and, honestly, I can't blame them, given the volume of work and the fact that some of the pleadings being unreadable really). Even assuming a Judge has read the file, argruments still help in drawing the attention of the Court to the chief contentions of the party and precedents in support thereof (the classical rule of drafting insists that precedents should never be made a part of pleadings). Arguments may even otherwise help in building a perception in the mind of judicial officer in your favor and against the other party by presentation which cannot always be made a part of pleadings.

Written Arguments are also important becuase they bring on record the points for consideration raised by a party, which may assist in Appeals in showing that an important factor was brought to the notice of the Court but was not considered.

In your case if the Repondent is avoiding argument, all the better for you. Insist before the Court that since the Respondent is not willing to lead oral arguments, let the Court reserve final orders and permit the parties to file written arguments till a resonable time in the meanwhile, if they so choose (it is quite common). 

can we file any additional arguments in appeal stage?

whatnot   25 January 2017

@Atul.

Thank you. Fantastic insight.

Please do share information on regular basis. It helps to stratergise mose of querist here.

As most of them come as not knowing anything at all.

I do see a trend of template usuage with no relevance to the case . This is bane and it usually undermine their own process.

Thank you.

If time permits, please do write often.

 

Dr. Atul [9013898936] (Lawyer, Scholar)     25 January 2017

Originally posted by : sai narayana
can we file any additional arguments in appeal stage?

I think the appropriate question here would be, whether you can file additional grounds in appeal stage (not additional arguments, to be precise). So far as additional grounds on facts, not raised in trial, are concerned, ordinarily, you would not be permitted to raise them afresh at Appellate stage (applies cumulatively to all successive Appellate stages). As you cannot add any additional facts, I guess that answers the query towards additional arguments arisng from such additional facts.

sai narayana   25 January 2017

Originally posted by : Atul (public ID)



Originally posted by : sai narayana



can we file any additional arguments in appeal stage?





I think the appropriate question here would be, whether you can file additional grounds in appeal stage (not additional arguments, to be precise). So far as additional grounds on facts, not raised in trial, are concerned, ordinarily, you would not be permitted to raise them afresh at Appellate stage (applies cumulatively to all successive Appellate stages). As you cannot add any additional facts, I guess that answers the query towards additional arguments arisng from such additional facts.

My query is on filing additional arguments only without adding any additional grounds/facts during appeal.

Sachin (N.A)     25 January 2017

Originally posted by : sai narayana



Originally posted by : Atul (public ID)






Originally posted by : sai narayana



can we file any additional arguments in appeal stage?





I think the appropriate question here would be, whether you can file additional grounds in appeal stage (not additional arguments, to be precise). So far as additional grounds on facts, not raised in trial, are concerned, ordinarily, you would not be permitted to raise them afresh at Appellate stage (applies cumulatively to all successive Appellate stages). As you cannot add any additional facts, I guess that answers the query towards additional arguments arisng from such additional facts.





My query is on filing additional arguments only without adding any additional grounds/facts during appeal.

 

In appeal one can make additional arguments to show the errerd part of the judgement.

Dr. Atul [9013898936] (Lawyer, Scholar)     25 January 2017

Originally posted by : Sachin

Originally posted by : sai narayana

Originally posted by : Atul (public ID)

Originally posted by : sai narayana

can we file any additional arguments in appeal stage?

I think the appropriate question here would be, whether you can file additional grounds in appeal stage (not additional arguments, to be precise)

...

In appeal one can make additional arguments to show the errerd part of the judgement.

You see my dilemma Sachin? Arguments to substantiate error in judgment of the first instance are simply arguments (or arguments in support of the appeal)  ... hahaha ... they are not additional arguments... as in, additional to what? If Sai Narayana meant more arguments after one round of arguments had already concluded in the appeal, then maybe additional arguments to arguments already made in appeal.,,and I'd say they can be made with the leave of the Court, even more so if the judgment has already been reserved after arguments have been heard!

windowsxp   25 January 2017

Dear Experts i'm really happy to see the responses here, so i conclude, respondent have chance to drag the case.

during first judgement date, judge got transferred and they gave a new date.

on next date respondent is present in court and when judge asked arguemnts were filed or not she didnt opened her mouth and my lawyer said we already filed written arguments and we expected judgement last time itself.

so Judge considered this case for judgement on next date, if again they come on next date and take date for oral arguments/written arguments when this drama will end??

Regards,

Srinivas

 

 

 

 


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