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Something to consider

Page no : 2

Democratic Indian (n/a)     12 May 2012

Originally posted by :randomethic
" Anyway, my point is, India's work culture has not reached a place where companies are actually the "Equal Opportunity Employers" they claim to be and for an unemployed married woman who took a break because she got married, even if she's capable of working, it's not as simple as most of us think, to find a decent job. "

"Equal Oppurtunity Employer" label is just an eyewash. Crux of the matter is that most of the companies want their employees to be working blindly for them like donkeys all their life. They do not want such employees who have experienced or can dare to dream of life of financial freedom and liberty from employment. The moment they get an inkling that this person can dare to survive without their employment, he or she becomes unnattractive as an employee for them. This is one of the reasons they try to probe and poke so much into the mind and personal life of the employee.

The key is to speak only what they want to listen from you in the interview. The moment you utter something they do not want to hear, you are creating problems. In order to get the job, one may try two approaches, one is keep wisely trying giving interviews in as many companies as possible.  Surely some will click. Other is try in those industries where there is always a shortage of employees for example international call centers of reputed companies etc. Since these intenational call centers work in night shifts only, there is high rate of employee attrition. Hence they do less nakhra while recruiting employees. Later on one may switch to some other company of choice.

Originally posted by :chandrasekhar.7203@
" After some years Corporates in order to force employees to devote completely to their businesses, will encourage "live in" relationships (among male and females) in their Staff quarters and discourage the concept of family.  They will say to employees, "shaadi karke kyaa karne kaa yaar".  And consensual s*x among adults is not a crime in India. "

Many companies are already doing it. May be not openly but subtly. They arrange weekly "get togethers" or "parties" on off days and encourage many things which you can obviously understand. The main aim is that employee brainwashing and should get emotionally attached so that they do not leave the organization. They literally force each and every employee to come and attend the "party" under the guise of promoting "team spirit".

All valid and true observations by you in all your responses in this thread about the corporate culture and modern dictatorship.

Roshni B.. (For justice and dignity)     12 May 2012

in india,there is so much drama and strictness towards employees for the sake of hard work,2 ensure better productivity...

so,after seeing all this,any third person may wonder why this country hasnt progressed as much as it shud have

bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

This is offered as an argument for wife-who though educated and perfectly capable of working sits at home and commands maintenance.

1) Men also experience difficulties: A false 498a and DV is a mental harassment which impinges on the performance of a man. This can easily affect his job performance. Is that taken into consideration while awarding interim maintenance?

2) Also consider the harassment and suspicion and tantrum of a wife where husband comes home late because of his responsibilities at work. yet she wants all creature comforts-which she thinks she is entitled to. Is that considered cruelty?

3) If due to such harassments husband loses his job-should the wife be held accountable?

Now coming to educated non working wife:

1) Did she voluntarily quit her job or husband forced her to do so?

2) If she did quit her job-has she attempted to apprentice herself to gain experience and climb the ladder -like all unemployed and inexperienced people do?

3) Has she worked on acquiring new skills and education that would make her eligible for better paying jobs?

4) Can she ask for husbands support only to get back on her feet in a limited time frame?

Let us consider the scenario where husband dies and she is alone-who should take care of her?

Will she or will she not get a job to feed her children? Is the government going to pay her maintenance?

I think a lot neds to be looked at.

A woman who wants to work will do so.

Again the accusation that educated perfectly capable woman who is not working does so deliberately, so as to get easy maintenance from a hard working husband, immorally-if not illegally, holds perfectly true. It is legal because government and courts says so. It is a law that can be changed! Then it may become illegal.

If so, women should get out of work place. How come so many women are successful at work place? People who work in kitchen cannot complain of heat/ smoke. Complaining women complain irrespective.

bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

Workplace are enormously risky for men as well. Women-largely due to media hype think managing household is something herculean. It is nonsense.

bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

Women must start appreciating the man's efforts to put the food on their table. Harassing and nagging will not work.

randomethic (Professional)     13 May 2012

Actually, Mr Bhalla, this is offered as an argument against most people assuming that finding a job at all, and it may be any job is really simple.


This is not about cruelty to the husband. In any case, most working wives also go home and do all house-work, and the working husband behaves like a king, does that not amount to cruelty to the wife, then? But I suppose the counter argument to that will be, "Who asked the wife to work, when the husband is working? And if she is working because that is what she wants, then why should she be given any special treatment?" 


It takes two people to make a marriage work. This thread has NOTHING to do with harassment and cruelty. 


As for skills and upgrading them and all of the other things you've mentioned, I'm thankful for that because the things and discrimintion at workplaces is despite being the right person with the right experience and skills for these jobs and often simply, because we're women. No amount of bringing harassment at home etc., etc., can change what is true.


I am one of those successful working wives of today, but only I know how I have got here and no, no man will ever have to face rejection from a job because he will potentially take leave to have children. Men might face hardships at work, but not to this degree that infringes upon their very right to work based on their gender.


Regardless of why a woman quits working (a fair split between self motivation and being forced to), the bottom line is that finding a job isn't as simple as it is made out to be. I can write plenty about harassment and cruelty by husbands and their families, but this thread is NOT MEANT for those issues which have been debated aplenty at other places.


I will however say this, instead of looking at all women and what they're doing wrong and pointing this thread in the direction of working women who are successful, why don't the men here look at other men whose marriages are successful and figure out what they're doing differently?? We cannot blame women for everything and that is the primary focus of your response which is quite a disturbing trend.

randomethic (Professional)     13 May 2012

If managing a household is really not a big deal, why don't men try it for a change (the whole range of things, not just one) and then speak rather than just blaming the media or their wives for it?


Go to work, do all the household activities, participate with happiness at home with whatever is happening there (good, bad, ugly all of it) Manage the happiness of everyone in the house including your own,  if it's such child's play, why don't men embrace it too?  


For a day and actually live the way your wives live...then, if you don't feel like having s*x because you're tired or feel upset with her and she calls you cruel for these things and accuses you of harassing her, wanting to break the family apart because you didn't get along with her family very well for a few moments, let's see how men handle that and if it still feels like 'not such a big deal.'

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bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

Men are doing household chores. getting groceries, getting milk, cutting vegetables, cooking etc etc. They are even bathing children and getiing them ready for school. There are folks who do that and then there are mothers who are not good at caring for children either.Tney are terrible cooks.  This idea that men can't do these things is utter nonsense.What is also true is a woman complaining and complaining endlessly.There are wives  watching soaps and talking endlessly on mobiles as though they are stuck to their ears, while husbands are getting their kids to do homework and getting them to eat. There are tons of men who can cook. It is not difficult. Men can take care of household. It is not difficult.

As women have entered workplace men have entered households!

randomethic (Professional)     13 May 2012

Not all men and not all women are doing as you say, sir. Plenty or men and women have normal, balanced married lives that they are making work by being loving, kind, honest and generous towards each other, realizing that the primary relationship is their own and if that is a good and harmonious then everything will work fine and they're the only ones who can make such a thing happen.


For either gender, these are the people we need to look up to to understand what they're doing right and how we can make our relationships better. At the end of the day, whether the other person can change or not is not in our hands. We can only choose to do our own part and hope that it works. Likewise, when it comes to blame, we need to stop thinking we did everything right and only the other person did everything wrong. Success and failure of a marriage is dependent on both people. One person/gender cannot be made the scapegoat.


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bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

Sure marriages work when both make it work. The successful ones have divided their responsibilities. Generalization that men cannot manage house work etc is invalid. The blanket statement like they behave like kings hold no water either. Not all women are good. There are tons of women who are plain lazy, naggers and complainers. There are others who say my way or highway. No one can tolerate that. A woman may be kicked out because of attitude issues, work ethics etc. A boss male/ female will not tolearte such things -a hapless husband may do!

Workplace is competitive- if you are not a good candidate you are not. The fact that there are successful women indicate that one can be successful. There will be hurdles and difficulties. But women who want to complain will complain, no matter what. It is easy to say -oh my god they just didn't want me because I am a woman. yeah right! As long as law allows it complainers will complain and get away with it. Cut maintenance and they will get the job in a jiffy and they will do whatever it takes to get and hold a job. Men have been doing that all this time. They did that despite difficulties and hurdles both from a harassing boss at work and a nagging/ irritating wife at home!

So are mothers not working?The highest CEO of the country is a woman and she is/was married! There are maternity rules that are strictly enforced. If not you can always complain and law will take effect. They even get full pay while they are at home caring for their babies.they get time to feed their baby at work. This is the law. The law is taken very seriously. However complainers again say OMG I am a Mom so I cannot work! There are tons of mothers who work two jobs in the west and make ends meet. The only bottomline again is woman actually have it easy since they can sit idly while hardworking husbands are ordered by courts to pay maintenance. Indian courts are extremely liberal in that context. PWDVA gets you maintenance amount ordered in 3 days flat. Infact working woman may get less maintenance! So the law is infact discriminative against working woman! Idlers have the best thing going for them. Enjoy free money.Why would they want to work?

So this argument that Oh I cannot get a job because I am a woman just doesn't hold up.It is like saying Indians can't win medals because the olympic committee discriminates against us since we are Indians and we look different. The reality is known by one and all!

bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

Divorces happen because they cannot get along.

Let me give an example:

If husband is a drunkard and wife is Ok with it. Marriage will work. If she does not want him to drink.It won't work. If man drinks regularly creates problems and yet wife wants to live with him. Marriage works. If she does not marriage won't work. If husband drinks occasionally and wife is Ok with that. marriage works. If wife insists that if husband drinks even once and husband wants to drink, marriage won't work.

Similarly If a husband is OK with a jealous, lazy, incompetent, nagging wife marriage works.If he doesn't it won't. If a husband tolerates his wife disrespecting and harassing his parents marriage works.If he doesn't and wife won't change, it won't.

One can put any number of examples.

But this has deviated from the topic.

bhima balla (none)     13 May 2012

The bottomline is: If one wants a job bad enough, they will get it. If one gets free money, they may have less incentive to get a job and find other reason/s to explain their idleness.

1 Like

randomethic (Professional)     13 May 2012

Again, I had hoped your response would be neutral but it's not. 


As for your contention that complaining women complain etc., on the subject of employment, no matter how much is said, my personal experience shows differently. Especially, since it is not that I assumed anything was being implied but because I was CATEGORICALLY TOLD certain things and asked about my plans to have children (in which case the company didn't want to employ me even though I had the right skills for the job - which they admitted but because I would need to take leave) which clearly reeks of discrimination. 


PS. Complaining men also complain but then there are those whose marriages are successful and not for reasons that they have become martyrs in their homes but because there really are good women and good men too.

Ranee....... (NA)     13 May 2012

I am a 36 years old  lady.I was working in a good school for 5 yrs afetr marriage.In this period I did LLb.After that i got busy with business and daughter.Now when my younger daughter also starting going school I took admission in a 1 yr diploma course.I go to class after dropping my daughter in school.Some of questions asked to me by other mothers(of my daughters classsmates)while waiting outside the shcool..are

"you are studying in this age, any specific reason?

You  are studying now, will you do job after completion?

when you go to class who is there to stay at home?

You go to class with T-square, set -square , don't you feel shame?

why you need to study, you are earning from your business?


this is mindset of many woman, they cant do anything after they become mother or wife.But I dont think so.Learning has no age bar.

What's wrong If I earn from my creativity?



1 Like

randomethic (Professional)     13 May 2012

That's great to know Ranee ma'am. Infact, I am glad you have written because indeed, many women themselves lose sight of the fact that they can work after marriage for their own individual reasons. 


Infact, I have become so tired of facing these un-necessary struggles related to employment that I feel I should seek something I can do on my own.  


There are several psychological / sociological / environmental reasons beyond having fun sitting idle on someone else's money as highlighted by other members here that act as deterrents to finding suitable/gainful employment.


People like us, we keep trying and do find something that suits us to do. I just meant to highlight (and I know I am repeating myself) that it's not truly fair to consider being educated as the sole reason for why a married lady should work and there are plenty of other factors that influence whether she works or not. Ultimate decision is hers, ofcourse if someone is a strong personality and knows what they want, for their career,  they will still go after it and get it for themselves.


As pointed out by Mr Bhalla infact, the primary reason for writing this has been to highlight that being educated alone does not mean one is automatically employable. 


Once we can understand the underlying reason why someone is not working, rather than using the blanket assumption that the other person doesn't want to work even though they have qualifications on paper, we are better placed at figuring out the right solution for us and for them. 


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