Donation to housing society while sale of flat

prices are escaled more than ten fold so what is harm in giving a small part for society.

Dear Mr. JSDN,

In your earlier answer to my question regarding eviction of tenants by religious trust owner, you said that eviction is not possible.  On the contrary, other eminent advisors to my question said that it is possible and then you also changed your reply.  Now also you are not advising me properly.  In the contrast, you are wrong guiding me to pay donation to society.  First you have not asked me the amount of donation and just misguided (jyada hoshari marte ho aap) and further said that prices of the property are increasing and why not make the payment of donation.  For your kind information, I say the thief societies are demanding Rs.1 lac, 2 lac etc. depending upon the area.  Is this correct to pay unjustified amount to thief societies.   Is it mentioned in the books of laws to pay hard earned money in unjustified way to thief and dacoit hsg. societies.  Further if you are giving these types of advices to others, you are bogus.

Bogus answer

@ Author

1. The model bye-laws framed by the State government under the Maharashtra Cooperative Societies Act hold that a person does not require a no objection certificate (NOC) from the society at the time of transfer of a flat.

2. Bye-law No. 38 clearly prescribes a list of documents required for selling a flat, but nowhere is it mentioned that the society’s NOC is mandatory nor it mentions anything about ‘donation from both sides making such deal’ ? Bye-law No 38 under the Maharashtra Cooperative Societies Act does not list an NOC from the housing society among the documents required to sell a flat. A society that refuses an NOC must give its reasons in writing.

Re.: SC Case laws Sanwarmal Kejriwal Vs. Vishwa Cooperative Housing Society, Churchgate  https://indiankanoon.org/doc/861691/ where the Apex court had ruled that a society could not bar the admission of a member if he met with the qualifications laid down under the bye-laws.

3. The model bye-laws of March, 2001, are clear that an NOC is not required from a society. S. 23 of the Maharashtra Cooperative Societies Act clearly emphasises the concept of open membership, where there is no scope for discrimination on religious background of joining member.

S. 23 of the Act emphasises open membership and nondiscrimination. Even a 2000 Judgment of the Bench at Mumbai HC says so.  

4. A society which has not adopted the 2001 model bye-laws can continue to be guided by the old byelaws under which an NOC was needed. All societies are expected to adopt the 2001 model bye-laws. If at all a transferor or transferee of a flat want an NOC from the society for their personal reasons, the society will have to issue it within a month of receiving the application. If a society refuses an NOC, the law requires it to give its reasons in writing.

Just check with secretary of referred Society which bye-laws had been adopted by his society and specifically ask for clause on donation mentioned under their adoption Code?

PS: The reply of @ JSDN a Advocate is un-ethical and carried forward biasness and should have been avoided making ink reference in legal forums!

It is easy to preach and criticise. If you are sure for law why it is not enforced in any society.

Dear Ms.Tajobsindia,

Thanks for your valuable advice on the problem of donation to thief hsg. soc. and your criticism over JSDN's no-class bad advice.  You are intelligent unlike JSDN.

If the hsg. soc. tells me that they have not yet adopted the new model bye-laws 2001 and hsg. soc. refuses me to give in writing the reason for non-giving noc and transfer of shares and demands lacs of rupees, what to do in that case.  Because all hsg. soc. are thieves and they won't forget their donation easily.  All hsg. soc. behave like landlord of pagadi chawl.

@ JSDN

If the comment is indirectly for me too then all I would add here is that being member of Bar let us not become Judges and Jury all rolled into one to a enquiry. In legal forums people come for remedy and not come to get tangled in web of why, when and how of its implementations and or its ultra vires and or Writ jurisdiction so limited question by any queriest needs limited answers.

Here is addendum gyani especially crafted for you in case you want one right now from professionals J

If a co-operative society is old it may continue to follow old byelaws. But when a new co-operative society approaches the Registrar it would have to compulsorily adopt the new byelaws. Under the Maharashtra Co-operative Societies Act 1960, a housing society is free to adopt its own set of laws that governs its members. These are called byelaws and are limited to the Maharashtra State.

Byelaws are the rules that govern a co-operative society and its members and these undergo changes from time to time through amendments whenever the Government feels the need for changes.

Illustration:- The cash on hand limit under the old byelaws was Rs. 300. Cash on hand is maintained by the society for day to expenses such as plumber's and or gardener’s payments for instance. Over the years it was felt that the amount was not sufficient. And hence in the new byelaws the same has been increased to Rs. 4,500. Such changes under various headings become imminent and that is how the new model byelaws came into effect from July 2, 2001 came into force. Since then, the Government has made it mandatory for co-operative societies in Maharashtra to adopt the new byelaws.

Also note these byelaws are district specific. In other words while these are more or less the same there could be minor changes depending on which district a member fall in whether it is Mumbai, Pune or Thane.

Here are some of the differences between the old and the new byelaws.

Transfer of flat: Under the old byelaws in case you were to transfer your flat, a charge of 2.5% of the difference in the purchase value minus sale value would be levied as transfer charges. But under the new model byelaw number 45 all that has been scrapped and a common charge is levied as per the general body resolution subject to the condition that it is not above Rs 25,000. Also the Society needs to meet/pay TDS on this charge as per tax Laws.

Maintenance: Under the old byelaws the maintenance charged varied among members. For instance, let us say the monthly maintenance amount payable was Rs 500. Now if the flat was given on leave and licence, the maintenance charge would be hiked to Rs 1,000. For the same one need ot refer to general body resolutions ofd the Society made from time to time.

But as per the new byelaws, maintenance is 10% of service charges. Service charges include salary of the office staff, liftmen, watchman, the property taxes, electricity charges, water charges, etc. in case the society has an independent office.

That apart it also includes entrance fees for affiliation to the housing federation and any other co-operative institution, audit fees for internal, statutory and re-audit if any besides expenses incurred at meetings of the general body, the committee and the sub-committee retainer fees, legal charges, statutory enquiry fees among others.

Purchase of second flat: Under the old byelaws there were restrictions on holding more than one flat. A member was needed to obtain the Registrar's permission to purchase a second flat in the same society or within the limits of a certain district.

Member was also needed to submit an Affidavit saying that you do not hold any other flat in the same district. For instance, if you were the owner of a flat in Mumbai you could not own another flat in the same city. But another flat in Pune or Thane was allowed.

In the new byelaws the same has been done away with. So you can very well purchase a flat in the same society. Under Byelaw number 62 of the new model byelaws all you need to do is make an application to the society saying that you intend to purchase another flat. It's the society's consent that matters.

Transfer among family members: Under the old byelaws there were transfer charges applicable even if the transfer was between family members.

But then under S. 6 read with byelaw number 3 of the model byelaws, no transfer charge is to be levied in case of transfer of flat to any one of the family members. Under byelaw number 3 (25) family members means the following group of persons: husband, wife, father, mother, sister, brother, son, daughter, son in law, brother in law, sister in law, daughter in law, grandson, grand daughter.

If a co-operative society is old and continues with the old byelaws it may do so as byelaws cannot be enforced by law per se. Also, in my opinion, there are many mistakes in it. For instance, under the new model byelaw number 61, the managing committee needs to inform the member in writing within seven days of the date of the decision of committee about cessation of a membership.

Why this is a mistake because a cessation of membership can take place when the member has sold his flat as we all know. And such communication in reality takes more than seven days or even a month since the committee needs to find out whether all dues such as electricity bills, housing loans if any among others have been paid or not and all these practically not possible to comply with in 7 days time frame ! But then note that when a new co-operative society approaches the Registrar it would have to compulsorily adopt the new byelaws so there pops few minor lacunas in even adopting new model bylaws.

Few pointers to @ Author’s subsequent question are mentioned above and alternate approach for remedy is available before Court under Writ Jurisdiction and or via PIL route. 

Dear expert 

Even i am having the problem with my society i.e my flat is at vitawa thane our building was registered in 2002 feb from that date till date we have not receives any balance sheet   . In name of audit and a/c writing fees a charge of Rs 9000 is been taken per year at the same time the auditor appointed is the son of the chairman .He has done Some GDCA along with BCOM. If  any expense comes they take 1000 to 5000from all the people  and if asked about the maintainance money they say all the money is over we have paid for motor bill and starcase bill they come in groups from door to door asking for the money and says give us money right now  or tell the date when u can pay us. the building is of 2 floor ie G+2. Flats are 25. If any meeting is conducted in that meeting the secretary comes fully drunk and starts using bad language all the people are scared of him and no one dares to ask him about the  maintainance money.They have made a group of 5 people who are looting badly to the society.the chairman was early working in co-operative society department thane now he is retarted but still the chairman of the society. Can any action be taken on such people.

Dear Ms. Tajobsindia,

Thanks for your advice.  You said bye-laws no.38 doesn't ask for any noc from hsg. soc. and therefore it is assumed by me not to pay any amount to hsg. soc and further shares cert. could get transferred without donation.  But you say that bye-laws no.45 has been ommited and societies are permitted to take transfer fees upto Rs.25,000/- under new bye-laws 2.7.2001.  Anyhow societies are going to get money from members for sale activity.  If we do not want to pay any amount to societies for noc and share transfer charges, is it possible?

@ Author

In my view YES. But then you yourself says that this Hsg Soc. has not adopted new model bye-laws so it is a tough contest of Rights over whims and fancies of closely controlled Executive CGHS members in referred case generic Writ in larger public interest is the call of the day to end all such lacuna in implementation.

BTW lady it seems till date my gender is still that of a male not Ms. !

@ Francis,

As per your brief all that is needed is making a group of 25 members and uprooting old Executive Committee to establish brand new Members committee with various responsibilities assiged. See where the collective will of rest of the 25 society members stands against few old timers in stated briefs situation. Yes Society members have right to review audit reports with P/L Balance sheet statements by way of subscribed membership status they enjoy and not getting the same periodicaly demands establishing new setup that is all. 

ha ha ha ...

Dear Mr. Tajobsindia,

If hsg. soc. is not formed by builder and occupants themselves formed hsg. soc. Therefore conveyance deed is not executed by builder in favour of members's formed society.  Then if seller takes noc from builder free of cost.  what are the results?

You said to file PIL against donation but cost of fighting case would be how much?  In our interest bein you lawyer, you should fight the case for us and myself with Francis and other victims of thief society may get relief and I can save my own money.   All of us can pay you for PIL.

Iska matlab chacha ko khud bhi doubt hai ki wo male hai yaa fem...

Mere chacha larki hai

Mere chacha larki hai

Mere chacha frock pahnenge

Mere chacha jhumke pahnenge